Saturday, October 2, 2010

The Thin Red Line Episode 2

GC set out to play very loose and aggressive in this video. This isn't his typical style of play but he wanted to get into some interesting spots and show his note taking/hand reading thought process. Take what you will away from the HHs below but some spots are far from standard.

  • Minraise against pro SS's because they only push fold. minraise gives us more leverage and better risk to reward.
  • BvB, a 3x raise shows an instant profit if villain plays less than 40% of his hands in the BB.
  • When someone bets the same size on the turn as they did on the flop, it means the turn card did not help or change their hand in any way.
  • Tight players tend to be bad post-flop because they don't get into very many spots.


100NL 6m - CO limps, Hero raises to $4.50 OTB with 4c4s, CO calls $3.50.
  • Flop: 4h2sTd ($10)
    • CO checks, Hero bets $10, CO raises to $20, Hero raises AI to $114.30, CO folds.
    • The CO limper is most likely a fish and the bet size on the flop is irrelevant. He either calls or folds here so a bigger bet is better. When he c/mr the flop, he usually has a Tx hand that most likely won't fold. Shoving here maximizes against that range because overcards could slow down or kill the action.
    • note: c/mr T42r folded to jam
    • GC from thread: If fish want to find out where they're at with a hand less than top pair, they usually donkbet. The other line they take is c/c. c/mr is usually top pair+ or air in my experience, and they never fold top pair. But both raise sizes are pretty equal in EV I think. I might get him to continue with a slightly wider range maybe by raising small, but I'll also miss some action if an ace rolls off or something on the turn then.


100NL 6m - SB fish raises to $2, Hero raises to $8 in SB with 9d9s, SB calls $6.
  • Flop: 9c3c8d ($15.20)
    • SB checks, Hero bets $16, SB raises AI to $94.35, Hero calls $78.95. SB shows T8hh.
    • This is the same fish from the hand above who made a c/mr and folded to a jam. This might be a better board to slowplay because it is very unlikely for the fish to have TP here but there are more draws so betting here is best. GC bet pot because villain is very unlikely to fold any hand that hits this board. I like the way GC fastplay his hands vs the fish. I take lines that are too standard against fish when it is more +EV to exploit their willingness to call or stack off light. 


100NL 6m - Hero in SB with Jc2d raises to $3, BB reg calls $2.
  • Flop: 7h2c8h ($5.70)
    • Hero checks, BB bets $5, Hero calls $5.
  • Turn: Qh ($15.20)
    • Hero checks, BB bets $11, Hero calls $11.
  • River: 3d ($36.10)
    • Hero checks, BB bets $18, Hero calls $18. BB shows Qs9d.
    • This is a pretty interesting hand. GC's thought process: When he doesn't Cb there, it looks like he is going to c/f. The BB is a regular so he will most likely stab with his entire range. If GC Cb's there, he will fold out all of BB's air and get raised by draws and some air. OTT, GC felt that the villain is most likely incapable of value betting thinly so with the overcard and flush out, he is either bluffing or value betting a Qx. OTR, same reasoning as turn. He either has Qx or bluff, if he value bets a strong 8x, then hes probably pretty good. 
    • note: bets large when wants a fold, smaller for value?
  • Q from thread: J2o - would c/f be too weak in this spot? I typically like to c/c marginal made hands on (ultra)draw-heavy flops and thought J2 here was worse than marginal. And we don't know much about villain's postflop tendencies yet.
    • A from GC: Why would you c/f with a pair in BvB? If you're gonna c/f you should just cbet. I check to let him bluff because when I check I look like air that's giving up. And as you see it worked.
  • Q from thread: Isn't it much better to c/r this type of hand since if he is cbetting his entire range the least amount of outs he has is 6 and a lot of turncards will force you to c/f..
    • A from GC: But I'm not planning to c/f alot of turn cards. If anything a bad card will make him more likely to bluff. By check-raising I just get called by all his pairs, open myself up to draw re-raises, etc. Yeah I (likely) fold out air but then I might as well checkraise this board with all my air myself. I'd rather checkraise for value/(semi)bluff and cbet or c/c with mere showdown value. Yes, it will put me in harder spots and checkraising makes the hand easier to play, but you shouldn't take a lower EV line just because it's easier if you're capable of handling the harder spots. If a flop c/c will put you in a spot where you don't really know what you're doing and you might make mistakes, then don't do it.
  • Comment from thread: I really dont agree with this, the worst part oh his range has like 6 outs, and i just think you have to little equity to c/c this. without betting initiative and being oop this cant be +ev... imo 
    • Reply from GC: Well, c/f is a horrible line, and c/r is not good for reasons I already posted. So it's a c/c or a cbet. If I cbet I put in 1 bet. If I c/c I also put in 1 bet. So the same amount of money goes in. But when I cbet, he'll continue with a tighter range than when I check. So I put in an equal amount of money, but I get more value. It also takes away his ability to (semi)bluffraise me. c/c just results in harder turn/river spots, but I think I'm equipped to handle them. If I wasn't, c/c would be bad. Harder doesn't mean lower EV.
  • Comment from thread: Yeah, I thought this as well. C/c makes this a guessing game vs a random player who we can only assume is a regular at this point. We can't call turn or river either imo because he doesn't know much of us and is unlikely to barrel total air with such a betsize, and any air he is barreling most likely has a broadway heart in it, which has a lot of equity against us.
    • Reply from GC: If you think he's gonna bet a lot of turns (and rivers) and it's just too much heat for us to continue with, then you should c/c with overpairs etc here, or with draws to c/r the turn because you get tons of value/dead money that way.
    • And just because a certain line makes the hand harder to play doesn't mean it has a lower EV. Sometimes the hardest line has a higher EV. The better you get at poker, the less you'll be guessing on the later streets. You only find the spot hard because you're not used to it and you're playing against a wide range instead of a well defined range. I suggest you try playing some HU because there every hand you'll be playing against a wide range and essentially playing a guessinggame, even against fish. Yet it's possible to have a winrate at HU despite these properties. If you really want easy decisions, stop playing 6max and go play FR, or even "better", SNGs.
  • I think I would not capable of playing the hand in this way or at least play it well enough to make it +EV, but the points I highlighted are invaluable. Easy does not equal most +EV. The best players are the ones that take lines that are non-standard just as GC did. It my not always be correct, but using good logic and having the courage to try will make you a better player. GC gave plenty of good reasons for his line in the hand above and I'll take it for what it's worth.


100NL 6m - Hero raise to $3 with Ad9c UTG, BB fish calls $2.
  • Flop: 5h5sKd ($6.20)
    • BB checks, Hero checks.
    • GC checks back the turn because the board is very dry and his hand has SD value. The check is meant to induce action on the turn from the fish.
  • Turn: 3s ($6.20)
    • BB bets $6.50, Hero calls $6.50.
  • River: 9d ($18.55)
    • BB bets $19.50, Hero calls $19.50. BB shows Ks8h.
    • GC would have called whether he hit the 9 or not. 
    • note: loose, pot bets for value


100NL 6m - Hero raises to $3 with 74hh in MP ($250), CO nit ($225) calls $3, BTN nit calls $3.
  • Flop: 3c5d6c ($10)
    • Hero checks, CO bets $9, BTN folds, Hero raises to $36, CO raises AI to $223.35, Hero calls $187.35. CO shows 4c4s.
    • I love the line GC took in this hand. The two nits in CO and BTN have tight ranges and a lot of it are going to be pocket pairs or overpairs that will stab. The nits 3b shove is good if he has a read that GC is c/r'ing a lot of draws there, otherwise it is bad.
    • note: jammed 44 200bbs deep over PFR c/r on 653tt (i had nuts)


100NL 6m - MP unknown raises to $4, CO regish calls $4, Hero in SB calls $3.50 with 3s3c.
  • Flop: 3h9cTc ($12.35)
    • Hero checks, MP bets $8, CO calls $8, Hero raises AI to $452.05 (~110bb eff stacks)
    • GC's plan was the c/r the flop with his bottom set but I feel like leading might be more profitable. He decided to c/rai instead of making a more standard c/r size because it looks more like a bluff which most likely means that he is just targeting the MP opener's overpair range. 



Notes GC took (how I would improve it):
  • limpcalled UTG and called 1 barrel on K72tt 
    • Lc UTG and called Cb on K72tt, c/f T
  • overbet jam draws 
    • db overbet jam draws: K8 on 675r (29-6), 33bbs eff
  • small c/r on 884tt, bomb flush turn BB v BU 
    • small c/r on 884tt, bomb FL T, BB v BU
  • fish with SS. didn't stab postflop w gutshot/oe/air @ triple check. 
    • fish SS. didn't stab IP w gs/oesd/air vs triple chk
      • the "/" separates the streets, first one is flop and so on.
      • we can probably gather that the SS fish is passive from the note above.
  • plays draws passively on A high board, didn't bluff river when missed 
    • plays draw passively on Ahi board, didn't bluff R IP when missed. call/call/chk w KQs on A8Ts-A-x
  • limps QQ, check twice on Qxxx, raise river on 4 straight 
    • limps QQ, chk F and T on Qxxx, raise river on 4ST
  • call 3b OOP and donk 9 (half) twice on Axxx fold to turn jam 
    • call 3b OOP, db 1/2p on F, same size on T and fold to jam on Axxx
  • potc/r'd flop w monsterdraw on T9x
    • same
  • c/mr TP on dry board, 40% pot turn, check trips on river
    • c/mr TP on dry board, 40% psb T, chk trips on R
  • checked back TP vs missed turn cbet, bet 2 into 14 with top 2 on riv
    • chk'd back TP IP vs missed Tb, bet 2-14 w top 2 on R
  • stabbed ~pot when he wanted folds
    • same
  • ~pot size as standard size?
    • ~psb = standard?
  • c/f 943r in BvB 
    • bvb, c/f 943r as pfr
  • checks the scare card when he hits it 
    • chked the scare card when he hit it in 3b pot OOP
  • bvb raise cbet on QT4tt, bet smallish again on J turn
    • bvb, raise Cb on QT4tt, bet smallish again on J T
  • checked A2s CO v BU on K42, bet bit less than half turn and bit more than half w trips river 
    • no Cb w A2s CO v BU on K42tt-Jt-2, bet T (4-8.50), bet R (9-16.50) w trips
  • call UTG raise and squeeze from SB, c/mr bluff AQx
    • call UTGo and sqz from SB, c/mr bluff AQx

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